The Supernatural convention in beautiful Toronto wrapped up yesterday — due to flight cancellations and all-around craziness, we didn’t arrive until mid-day Saturday, but damn, the con packed alot into the next 18 hours! (Though we’re still sobbing about missing what was by all accounts an epic karaoke. There’s nothing like watching the guy who so convincingly plays Death bounce around the stage like an exuberant teenager. Not to mention Matt Cohen in his cheerleading skirt, which no longer seems to want to cover his toned abs. Not that we’ve heard any complaints. Or lodged any.)
We missed the panel with Matt, Richard and Rob, but we did catch up with Richard and Rob recently to chat — check back here soon for our interviews with them and an update on what they’ve been up to and are looking forward to. Richard was, of course, the master of ceremonies for the con, as has become a Creation tradition. Unfortunately for Richard, the fans have now gotten wise to the fact that he’s the hapless person who has to come onstage and tell a guest to wrap it up — which resulted in groans of disappointment and a few boos. Poor Richard, he’s getting a complex.
We literally ran into the ballroom just in time to catch Ty Olsson onstage, which immediately cheered us up. Ty is unfailingly sweet, sensitive, sexy and irreverent simultaneously, which is a combination not many guys can pull off. The SPN con gang has clearly accepted him as one of them, and Ty hung around all weekend to join his friends in the kind of impromptu antics that make these cons so damn much fun. We love Ty’s affection for his character, Benny, and his respect for Benny’s bond with Dean.
Jim Beaver was next up, and when he walked onstage the audience gave him a standing ovation and several solid minutes of cheers. Richard commented later that he’d never seen another guest get that kind of reception — that’s how beloved both Jim and Bobby are by the fans. Most of us agreed with Jim when he said that, while he loved the episode ‘Death’s Door’, he’d trade that great episode for the chance to still be on SPN. Jim is also funny as hell, with a self deprecating wit that makes us all love him even more. His story about daughter Maddie signing her reluctant dad up for a questionable online dating site was hysterical. Chip off the old block, that one!
Jim is also a fabulous writer, so we are still squeeing over the fact that he just told us that he stayed up all night last night reading our new book Fangasm — and felt it really captured the wild and wonderful world of Supernatural fandom. That totally made our day!
After Jim, it was time for the costume contest, which gets more popular every convention. There were some amazing cosplayers, among them at least forty trenchcoat wearing angels, some sprouting wings from the back, some covered in blood, some trenchcoat-crossdressing. There’s really nobody else who could judge that kind of cosplay — Misha Collins came out to do the final selection of a winner, much to everyone’s delight.
Then it was the Misha and Mark (Pellegrino) panel, which included Misha bringing out a flaming birthday cake for a fan who was in his meet and greet and confided that she’d celebrated her birthday alone. Now she was celebrating it with none other than Misha, Mark and a room full of thousands of fans!
Misha got some interesting questions, as you can tell by his expression here. And Mark’s.
Misha got lots of questions. Some were amusing.
Some were puzzling.
Some were headdesk-inducing.
And some brought out the devil in the guy who plays an angel.
Finally a fan came up to the mike and said “I have a question for Mark.” The audience burst into applause, and Mark leapt out of his chair in victory.
Even Misha was happy about it.
Mark has the most adorable smile. Hard to believe he played such a convincing Lucifer. Though, come to think of it, even as Lucifer we couldn’t help finding him kinda cute. I mean, look at him!
Saturday night was for socializing and re-connecting with lots and lots of fans. And food, which you never find time to eat at cons until frighteningly late in the day. And drinks, because they went well with the food. Hey, we’d had a tough time getting to Toronto, we were in need of celebration!
Rob Benedict kicked off Sunday with a panel that inexplicably included Ty and Misha turning him upside down while Richard watched and laughed and most of us shook our heads and muttered “they are such boys” with great fondness.
Yes, that last one includes gratuitous shots of Misha’s and Ty’s ass. You’re welcome.
Sunday, of course, is all about “the boys,” and Jared and Jensen didn’t disappoint. Fans came out of the morning photo ops and confided to other fans still waiting in line that “they’re in a great mood!” We keep thinking that one of these days that won’t be the case — we’ll catch them on an off day (they’re only human, after all) or they’ll have lost their enthusiasm for the show, or for the cons, or something. But it never happens. It’s sort of the same for us — you can be in a terrible mood (let’s say your flights kept getting cancelled…ahem…) and then walk into a Supernatural con and be greeted by friends you haven’t seen in maybe an entire year and hugged by the actors who make that Show you love and all of a sudden, you’re euphoric instead of irritable. EVERY SINGLE TIME.
We were lucky enough to go to both Jared and Jensen’s meet and greets on Sunday, but were asked not to share them. Up until now, we’ve been allowed to jot down a few notes, but not even a pen or piece of scrap paper are allowed anymore, so we couldn’t remember much even if we weren’t asked not to share. To be honest, we’re pretty upset about it, especially because apparently some of the fans in the meet and greets complained about them being shared. Our belief is that fandom is ALL ABOUT sharing. It’s a gift economy, not a market one — fans create art and fiction and meta and vids just to share them with other fans, investing huge amounts of time and energy and creativity and making not a penny. Fans who are lucky enough to go to cons share their photos and experience with others who would love to go but can’t. It’s one of the things we love most about fandom, that it’s based around sharing and support and collaboration, when most of the rest of the world is just the opposite. We put time and effort into live tweeting and posting reports when we get to go to cons, because we want to share our joy with the rest of fandom. We’re tremendously grateful when fans do the same thing for us at all the European cons that we can’t go to. So we’re a bit demoralized and dismayed, and hope you won’t yell at us about it. That said, I don’t think anyone can quibble with us if we share our own questions and the J’s answers, and a show-related tidbit that’s anything but ‘private’ (Actually there’s no definition of private that includes a room full of 22 people at a convention…) Luckily we asked more than one, and because they were our questions, we actually sort of remember them. But please note, it’s sort of!
Jared always turns his chair around and straddles it while he talks — that is, when he isn’t jumping up to demonstrate something. So he answered Lynn’s question from his perch on the high chair, which is completely adorable.
Lynn: In your ‘Girl on Guy’ podcast, which by the way was awesome, you said there was a deleted scene in the premiere, where Sam wanted Dean to prove that it was really him (and Sam was really dead). I’m dying to know what it was!
Jared: It was actually the scene in the beginning, Sam and Dean in the Impala, and Dean is saying “You’re dead,” and Sam’s like “Yeah, right.”
He then explained that the Dean in his head said something that only Sam would know about himself, and it turned out to be about a teenage Sam telling people (presumably his big brother) that he got a handjob from some girl, but he really didn’t. (Details fuzzy here because Lynn was busy laughing). Jared said that it didn’t seem right to him and Jensen, that it was too serious a scene and something funny would have ruined the momentum and the emotional mood. That happens alot, he said, that the writers will write a joke into the script, but it doesn’t work once they’re actually saying the lines so they’ll change it.
Lynn: Well, I trust you. You guys have good instincts.
It’s true. And it’s just another bit of evidence of how much Jared and Jensen care about these characters and this show. It would be easier just to say the lines and go with it, but they’re never cavalier about it. We get the feeling that nobody is. (Good thing, because fans certainly aren’t!)
The one other entirely show-related tidbit is that Jared actually got to play Ezekiel before Tahmoh, because they filmed out of order. When Tahmoh arrived to film his episode, he’d created a persona for Ezekiel and a way of playing him, and the director had to say well, actually, you need to see how Jared did it…
Fans: Awkward…
Luckily, it turned out to be alot like Tahmoh was planning to play the character anyway, so it all worked out. Jared expressed his admiration for Tahmoh as an actor, and so far, we agree.
When we chatted with Jared and Jensen a few months ago, they both talked about how much the conventions and the interaction with fans means to them. Jared said again in the meet and greet that he would hate to not have the cons, because just like it’s a place for fans to come together with their friends from all over the world, it’s also the place where the cast gets to come together. “I don’t know what I’d do if I couldn’t see Richard and Rob and everyone,” Jared said. We love that they’ve all become friends, just like so many of us have.
Lynn’s first question for Jensen in his meet and greet was also about the premiere. (If you read this blog, you know we had alot of FEELS about the premiere!)
Lynn: In the scene where Dean is trying to convince Sam not to go with Death, and says that memorable line, “There ain’t no me if there ain’t no you,” alot of us weren’t sure if that was actually Dean — if Ezekiel sent Dean in to convince Sam and then switched places with him to possess Sam — or if that was Ezekiel looking like Dean. When you were doing that scene, how were you playing it?
Jensen: I was playing it as Ezekiel.
Lynn: (gasping rather dramatically) Noooooo, that’s not the answer I want!
Jensen: (probably rolling his eyes a little at Lynn. Which is totally understandable) Sorry!
He went on to explain that Ezekiel was, however, expressing Dean’s genuine feelings about Sam, but putting it in words that Dean himself probably would never say out loud.
Lynn: *looks less traumatized*
In other words, the line was the truth, but we all know that Dean’s not very good at putting his feelings out there, which even Lynn had to admit was true. Jensen said similar things have happened in other scenes between Dean and Cas and between Dean and Sam. [ETA again, omg this is exhausting – another person who was there posted a clarification of what was said – thanks!]. Jensen said something about the scene with Cas beating Dean up, there was consideration of Dean saying ‘I love you,’ but it didn’t seem like something Dean would actually come out and say, so it was changed to ‘We’re family’ (My interpretation is that in both cases, he was talking about familial love, hence the change to ‘we’re family’. I also thought that might explain how certain priceless S8 gag reel scenes happened…) There have been times when they’ve considered the same for Sam and Dean, but the brothers just aren’t guys who are able to express their feelings openly. Jensen did leave Lynn with a bit of hope though.
Jensen: They should save that for the finale, then the brothers can finally say how they feel.
Lynn: *beams*
Jensen: *is relieved*
Lynn: Actually your explanation totally makes sense, as much as I wanted it to be Dean saying that line — that Ezekiel knew how Dean really feels about Sam, and put it in the words that Dean can’t say but Sam needs to hear.
Jensen: *beams*
Another thing we talked about when we chatted in August was Jared and Jensen’s excitement about Season 9, which they had only been filming for a few episodes at the time. So Lynn had a follow-up question at the meet and greet.
Lynn: When we talked about it last, you said you were really excited for Season 9. Do you still feel that way?
Jensen: Yes. Especially now, because Episode 9 is a game changer, and I’m really excited about it. That’s the thing about this show, you get some episodes down, you might start to get complacent, and then they change it up. It’s what keeps it exciting — and what’s kept the show on the air!
Lynn: *is beaming again*
After the meet and greets, it was time for the J2 panel. The ballroom at this hotel is gigantic, and it was an emotional (and loud) moment when the boys took the stage while ‘Carry On My Wayward Son’ played. Jared and Jensen both wore plaid, and can we just say that it suited them?? Boy, did it ever. We’re having a shallow moment here, but come on, look at them!
A fan asked them what their ringtones were. Neither could remember, so they pulled out their phones and began calling each other. “Boring,” they announced at the standard rings.
Fans: *disagree*
Honestly, these two could read the phone book and it would still take us an embarrassingly long time to get bored.
After all these years, Jared and Jensen are as close as ever. The opening video was an ode to being best friends, and left the entire audience going “Awwwww”.
There were a million funny moments that are no doubt available all over the internet already, but we caught a few. Jensen told the story of when they auditioned for SPN. Usually at auditions there’s a waiting room full of people, but when Jensen walked in, it was only Jared, sitting on the couch. Jared interrupted his story:
Jared (in mock delight): “And Jensen said, ‘Is this my birthday?'”
We also got a hug, which makes us just as gleeful as when we get one from Sam and Dean.
Jared talked about how he’s played Sam for such a large portion of his life, and lamented that he now had a few gray hairs. Jensen helpfully investigated, and then plucked one out to corroborate. Such a good friend.
The time goes by ridiculously fast when J2 are onstage. At the end of their panel, they always give credit to the fans for keeping the Show on the air all these years, and express their gratitude. It never fails to make us wish we had a box of tissues nearly.
Jared and Jensen then turned to each other and gave a high five, sharing their success with the fandom that helped make it possible. Damn, where are those tissues?
Stay tuned for our chats with Richard and Rob. And if you’d like to read lots more of our chats with Jared, Jensen, Misha, and the rest of the SPN gang, order your copy of our behind the scenes roadtrip through Supernatural fandom, Fangasm: Supernatural Fangirls from the amazon link at the top right of this page!
As always, thank you for sharing your con experiences! Sorry to hear that the complaints of a few caused TPTB to ask you not to share meet & greet details with the greater fandom. I like your definition of sharing & the gift economy. Makes sense & feels right! Goes right along with your Fangasm message that it’s ok to love what you love! Keep writing & I’ll keep reading. 🙂
This! Yes, I agree completely.
Thank you!! I was there but I have been suffering terrible con withdrawal. You brought me new life. What a wonderful weekend!! And I was so very very pleased to meet Lynn.
~ Jo
Just a great read..again!! Now, if you ever get delay issues and I’m at the same con I’ll be more than happy to pick up what I can for you..info & pix. You can always use my stuff, if you think it’ll help.
Enjoyed your thoughtful questions. And I’m glad you touched on the point that this fandom is about sharing. I understand there are restrictions, but not total alienation of information. So, thank you for all the eloquence. It’s most appreciated.
Such an awesome report. I always look forward to your write-ups after every con. Btw, your latest book has already been added to my Christmas list and I may or may not have hinted this to my family rather heavily lol!
Now I’m curious to know what video about their friendship was playing before the Js came on stage. I love watching fanvids like that. Do you remember the name or the song it was made to by any chance?
Thanks so much for sharing. I love your reports. I’m finding it harder to get excited about the show these days. It used to be a show about 2 brothers with 2 leads but it the last couple of seasons Dean/Jensen’s role has been stripped down to a supporting one and that would maybe be ok if the show didn’t continue to belittle the character again and again. I don’t know how Jensen got on the wrong side of TPTB but while they are punishing him they are also hurting the show and it’s fans.
Your excitement helps. I want to still love the show.
I thought it was telling that when Jensen, Misha, Mark and Jared did their interviews before the S9 premiere, each actor was asked about and talked about their characters–except Jensen, who was asked about Sam and had to talk about Sam.
I liked that you called out Creation for it’s current “no sharing” policy in the private meet and greets. I SO agree that your accounts mean so much to the people who
can’t be there. Let’s face it, cons are expensive! THANK YOU!
Their ain’t no me if their aint no you.
I cringe when I hear that line. Its basically Dean saying he’s nothing without Sam, which isn’t true. Its this line of thinking that leads Dean to making deals with demons (which lead to the first seal broken) and thinking he deserved to burn in hell for eternity for thinking he failed Sam.
Now we’ve seen that Sam made his peace with himself and the world and was ready to die, and Dean couldn’t let go because he’s their is no Dean without Sam. What’s going to happen because of his angel deal. Nothing good is pretty much a forgone conclusion.
Until Dean finds his own identity and his own sense of self-worth this pattern is going to keep repeating itself. Dean being his own person doesn’t mean he’ll love Sam less, its just that the relationship will be healthier and not cost lives or start apocalypses. Its not character growth when its starting to look like Dean’s incapable of learning from past mistakes.
Good thing it was actually Ezekiel saying that cringeworthy line and not Dean. It gives me hope that Dean’s not that much of a doormat.
I was so happy when it was Ezekiel saying that line and it makes me sad that is how Dean might actually really feel since I thought with season we see Dean start to find Dean as a person and not just Sam’s brother/parents and feel it kinda kills the development he has had. I’m waiting for this thing to blow up in his face so that maybe FINALLY he can try to find his Identity.
I’m so sad to hear the Js have said that Sam is the central brother and that Dean is there to support Sam. I thought this show was supposed to be about both brothers equally. I feel bad for Jensen, he is such an amazing actor and deserves more. i’m just so disheartened to hear this. I don’t think I can continue watching The Sam Show anymore.
Hi Liz,–my name is also Liz 🙂 I hope I can convince you that if both Jensen and Jared have agreed that Sam is central and that Dean supports, then what better reason is there to watch this show knowing that the actors know exactly what they believe and what they are doing with their characters? I think Jensen would be the first to acknowledge that his role has always been “protector”, “savior”, “fighter”–he said as much in “Trial and Error” to Sam. The writers have made this about Sam from the beginning. Nothing as changed. What I always remember is that Dean as Sam’s support system has pretty much stolen the show. While the show is about Sam, and we care for him, our heart has gone out to Dean as the flawed and damaged hero. Jensen is completely happy with his role, which I love, and his acting ability is what has drawn us in over the years. The writers have made Dean a character that no one will ever forget, while Jared is happy to branch out into different characterizations of Sam. Ultimately, the show IS equally about the brothers–about how they both approach the tragedies and fate that have befallen them. The show is perfect and cannot be improved, in my opinion. I hope I have convinced you to look at it a different way. All is as it should be–really 🙂
I really like your reply and totally agree with you. There are always complaints about one of the brothers not getting enough (be it screentime, meaningful interactions, story arcs etc.) but let’s face it: the story is told from Deans point of view and his point of view is Sam since he is 4. That’s what the writers gave us from the beginning. This is why we see so much of Sam but always in relation to Dean. We see Dean interact with other characters without Sam but -with a few exceptions- we only see Sam through Dean. No one ever said this is healthy. But it IS the show. And as long as Jensen and Jared enjoy it that way and love to play Dean and Sam we as fans should enjoy the show and all the great things instead of continious complain about the things we -personally – don’t like.
Sandy, thank you 🙂 I agree that Dean has pretty much focused on Sam since the beginning and that has been the premise for the show–Sam’s protection, keeping the family together as they know it, in spite of everything. And I know it’s hard for people to accept that the show has been structured this way when they really identify with one character over the other. I think when we focus too much on one person, we lose sight of the whole picture. I’d love to see Dean have a big, exciting romance, for example–now that just ISN’T going to happen!! ;D
Hi Liz! Thanks, but, Sorry, saying that Dean’s role is to just support Sam and be Sam’s protector isn’t enough for me. Dean is more than that, he’s an amazing character in his own right.
I didn’t fall in love with Dean because of his “epic” love for Sam, I fell in love with this character who lost his mother when he was 4, who wanted to help save people from what his family went through, who was so very smart and strategic, who had an an amazing compassion for people, especially kids, who looked out for others, who didn’t want to sacrifice the innocent, who has this great ability to make friends and allies, who would stand up to others when he should be scared, like Death, Zachariah, Uriel, etc. who keeps going and trying, no matter how many times he’s knocked down, who has flaws, makes mistakes, but apologizes with all that he is, who takes on the burdens and weight of the world.
That is more than being support staff for Sam and they’ve shown all of the above in the past. Season4 was an amazing season because he brother had their own mytharc and both were important. What’s changed behind the scenes in the past few seasons, I don’t know. But, its pretty clear to me that there has been a change, and not for the good, in my opinion.
Hi again, Liz 😉 You don’t have to sell how great Dean Winchester is to me, trust me. I think his character carries the entire show. I feel as thought he is the heart of the show and Sam may be it’s soul. I think all I was trying to say is that Dean has never even seen himself as much more than as someone who was set on this earth to protect Sam and fight evil–something he does extremely well. That WE see him as way more than that is why we care for him so much–we all want him to know how great he really is.
Anyway, naturally we’d love to see him with an entire arc all his own, with Sam in the background, but it’s always been about the boys’ co-dependency and always will be. I just have gotten to the point in life where I don’t mind sitting back and watching the show in whatever form the writers choose to give us, and I trust Jensen Ackles to know what’s best for his character. Also, NOT watching the show is just not an option! 🙂
One last thing–I do think that with his relationship with Benny, a monster, the Bunker and with Charlie, we have seen a lot of growth in Dean’s character. He’s nesting, he’s reaching out to people in a normal way just to help them get through something…season 1 Dean and season 9 Dean are two different people, and I do believe that while he still sees himself as Sam’s protector, he is not nearly has harsh with himself as he used to be, but he still sees his role in life very clearly, and it doesn’t bother him that this is what he is meant to do.
“Jensen is completely happy with his role”
Liz, I don’t think we can automatically jump to that conclusion. Jensen is a very good actor and these cons are PR opportunities. Of course he’s going to sell the show as it stands- that’s his job and he’s a consummate professional.
I think we can get more hints about Jensen’s feelings what he says in interviews, con appearances, and comments in the companion books. Like how Jensen said he was excited to be part of the mytharc and no longer just Sam’s brother (season 4 companion book.) Jensen didn’t say being a “guilty cheerleader” (an interesting choice of words for him, given that cheerleaders stand on the sidelines) was his favorite part of last season; he repeatedly said it was Purgatory. Jensen has talked about how he was jealous of Sam’s powers/demon blood storyline and wished there had been something like that for Dean. And now we’re hearing that Jensen has been auditioning for movie roles that would have overlapped with the SPN filming schedule and has been non committal when there’s talk of the show going past season 10 (while Jared has been very enthusiastic.) That’s different behavior for Jensen compared to past seasons.
No doubt Jensen enjoys the work environment, his fellow actors, and meeting the fans. But as I see it, making Dean revolve in ever shrinking circles around only Sam while giving the mytharc to Sam and Cas is not just boring for the character but I would think boring for the actor. Jensen likes to be challenged and I doubt Dean plating food for Sam or wringing his hands in worry (while Jared gets these awesome acting opportunities) would be all that professionally satisfying. Personally, I think Jensen would jump at the chance for Dean to be an equal partner in the mytharc because as we saw in S4, Dean could do that and still care deeply about Sam. They’re not mutually exclusive plot lines.
Thanks, Hannah. You’ve given me a lot of food for thought. You are definitely right that Cons are PR opportunities as are interviews, and you don’t trash the boss when you are doing them. The guys rarely say anything negative about the show, the plot, or the writers. I do know that Jensen has said he is fiercely protective of Dean and would never allow him to go into territory that he didn’t feel was right. That being said, you are correct in extrapolating that he still might not be thrilled with what he IS getting. And being the professional he is, he won’t divulge that.
Also, I see your point that Dean could have an arc and still be protective of Sam. Definitely not mutually exclusive at all. To be honest, I’ve wondered about some of Carver’s choices and I guess now that Ben Edlund is gone, there aren’t quite the creative minds behind the writing as there were. I’m sure that has made a difference.
I would like to know how you know about him auditioning for movie roles…do you have an inside track? Just curious.
Well, I suppose we can complain about the writing until the cows come home, and if we complained directly to the writers, it MIGHT have some influence to change how Dean’s role is written, but I doubt that even the SPN fans have that much influence–except maybe to discourage women lasting very long on the show! My main point is that no matter what they throw at us, I will be faithful to the show until the end. I just don’t see walking away from it at this point, for any reason.
That was absolutely a Brilliant explanation!!! THANK YOU – I Agree 100%
Jay Jaay–:):)
Ah, the question of whether it was Dean or Ezekiel in that scene was what I wanted to ask at the panel. Glad to hear it got answered. Thanks for sharing.
I was at Jared’s M&G and asked about how he and Tahmoh worked on the Ezekiel character. I do wish more people would focus on show specific questions at the panels. Especially now when there’s so many new questions because of the premiere.
It was Ezekiel channeling Dean’s genuine emotion. Makes sense since no way could angels mimic humans’ glorious messy emotion. What is deeply troubling is Dean fully participating in tricking Sam into possession, that was a shocker for me because ….. because not even Lucifer would trick Sam.
ITA on how Jare dand Tohmoh worked on the Ezekiel character, loved that somebody asked that question and wished more would.
I was glad to hear discussion of that too – one of those things I didn’t question in the first viewing, but thought about later.
Love this, ladies; thanks!
I have to say, though, the restrictions on reporting from the meet & greets are INSANE. Yes, fandom is sharing – and there is NO WAY I would ever spend the insane amounts of money commanded by the M&G’s if I couldn’t share what I learned with others. Did I ever go, I would use my carefully trained memory to recreate the entire thing, and that’s the truth.
Maybe it’s a good thing that my funds are currently limited, or I might be in a tussle with the Creation PTB.
Thanks for your reports as always, in spite of the gag order on you. I hope whoever complained reads this, because seriously? They’re selfish, to get that whole experience in person, so close to J2, and yet begrudge sharing the knowledge gained with those less able.
Karma meet ass…
Also, goddamn Misha in that waistcoat. He & Jim Beaver stole the show, IMO.
If I were ever able to go to a SPN convention, I would want to go with you guys!!! I love reading your stuff! Always makes me smile!
Thanks so much for your write-ups! I cannot believe people actually complained about you talking & relaying the meet & greets. I will greatly miss your detailed reports. As someone who will never be able to attend a con, much less a meet & greet, I have loved living precariously through you. So thanks very much for that!
Ah! I have such trust issues with the writers! This is an issue! 😉 But I’m just sitting here scratching my head that the writers actually wrote in a script Dean saying “I love you” to Cas. It seems so out of character. Beyond the fact that we know Dean is terrible at expressing his emotions in general, he has not even ever said “I love you” to Sam. or Lisa. As far as I can remember, he has only said it to his mom in “Dark Side of the Moon.”
No one doubts Dean & Cas are friends. And yeah, Dean does probably does love him…but I can imagine no situation in which he would ever voice it. If he were to voice his love to anyone, it would (in my opinion) have to be Sam.
It would be such a powerful thing for Dean to say and be such a HUGE deal for Dean.
Why was that line even considered?
I’m sure they’ve considered Dean saying ‘I love you’ to Sam before. He’s grown emotionally throughout the series and there have been multiple instances where it seems like he’s about to tell someone how he feels, but doesn’t. With Charlie, too. It really doesn’t even matter that the line was considered, because they didn’t use it. They realized it didn’t fit and it didn’t work. What they wound up with was fine.
Thanks for sharing another of your convention experiences. I always love to read them, especially now that I’ve been to one (VanCon) and I’m having withdrawal symptoms, lol.
I was just discussing with a friend last night my admiration for Jared and Jensen in the way that they are constantly acknowledging their fans. They are so humble and so grateful for our support… and so enthusiastic about the show. It’s really infectious. I don’t think I’ve ever been so excited about a season (which is remarkable, at this stage of the show)… because J & J were so excited when I saw them at VanCon.
I have also just received your book… cannot wait to read it. Thanks 🙂
“especially because apparently some of the fans in the meet and greets complained about them being shared”
ohh, that’s sad,,,
Thank you so much guys, for share what you can,, we really apreciate it,, I’ve been watching the show since 2005, but I haven’t been able to go to a Con,, and I don’t think I can in the future,, the Conventions are very expencive without adding the costs of planes and hotels,,
so I’m very grateful with the fans that share the vids and recaps and posts, pics,, etc,, there are really nice people in the Supernatural fandom,,
some times I’ve very stressful days but when I read somthing about the Con or the show I just go 😀 ,, and my problems kind of go forgotten for a moment,,, so thank you guys for sharing your experineces with us,, *big hug* 🙂
Such wonderful guys these pair and the bestest of friends. They are a pleasure to watch all these years on and i’m very happy with where they are taking season 9. People moaning already need to just stop watching because our fandom doesn’t need people constantly whining and criticizing a show they claim to watch. You’re not happy switch off, simple as, stop coming to forums posting as different people and constantly whining, it’s so old.
This show is about the brothers and their relationship it always has been it always will be. People saying Dean is sidelined exhuast me. He is never sidelined, he gets the humour, the internal storytelling and of course his priority is always going to be Sam that’s what has made the show thus far and will continue to do so, the totally messed up co-dependance. I don’t understand how you can dislike that after all these years. It’s been in place since day 1.
The day you start to make the Winchesters totally seperate and healthy and functional and thats the day Supernatural is no longer the show it was anymore. Sure it’s messed up and complicated and they are totally completely entwined but that’s what makes it BRILLIANT.
Sam fans lose a lot of the internal characterization of Sam sometimes, he’s posessed etc and we lose our chance to see what goes on inside his head, so those moments of internal sam winchester are a joy to behold. Dean gets that part but less of the possession/mythology sometimes. The balance could be worked on at times but overall I just want to see this codependancy and messed up relationship of brotherly love continue till the end.
Thank you for this report and for everything you do for fandom, we appreciate you fangasm and true fans always appreciate this show.
It was so wonderful to see you this weekend and catch-up. *hugs*
Thank you for the great write-up and photos.
This was one of the best cons ever. What a magical and happy time. It was so special.
*Hugs*
Thanks for the write up. I’m clinging to Jensen’s response about ep. 9 being a “game changer”. I think Dean can be Sam’s protector while protecting and helping all of humanity AND the angels, too. He is the One True Vessel of the High Commander of the Heavenly Host, for goodness sake! And geez, what’s wrong with wanting Sam to show more love and support for Dean-meaning over an extended period of time and several episodes, instead of through singular speeches that are mostly lip-service in random episodes that are then just retconned away in the next one-writers of Trial and Error and Man’s Best Friend w/ Benefits and Remember the Titans-I’m looking at you!
Yes, Dean IS smart and cunning and clever and an out-of-the-box thinker, and most especially-leadership material! These have ALL been shown to us as being parts of the Dean character series-long, too-not JUST Sam’s caretaker and protector. There is absolutely nothing wrong with asking the writers to give us these aspects of Dean back, IMO. He may have changed in some ways from S1-8, but those parts of him haven’t. They just haven’t been explored as much in the last three seasons under Sera Gamble and now Jeremy Carver, too.
Sam as the central character doesn’t have to mean Dean confined to being strictly and only All About Sam. At least it didn’t mean that in the first 4 seasons of this show-but it has felt that way to me from the end of S5-through the present(with the exception of Purgatory-my favorite thing from last season). This fandom has always been about the fans being able to speak their minds about things that we like AND things that we’re not crazy about and we’d like to see changed. I don’t know where this mentality that we should just love everything they give us or stop watching came from. It’s never been like that in this fandom.
So..,as I said, I’m clinging to what Jensen said about episode 9 and most especially HIS excitement over that because from what I’ve seen in interviews and promos up to now, he’s been the only one who hasn’t seemed as pumped about what was coming up for his own character. Hopefully, that will change in the second half of S9 and the Dean fandom(those of us still watching, anyway) will finally be rewarded for their patience in this area of the show. Sorry if some dislike reading about it, but, please see my previous statement about SPN fandom.
Thanks again for this, ladies.
It is Awesome. I always love to read your reports. Reading your reports of Supernatural conventions are the best part of post convention stuff.
We didn’t get much insight of Jared & Jensen’s M&G this time which is making me sad because you guys are the only ones who can make us all (me and fans like me who can’t go to the SPN Cons) feel like we are attending the Con.
I don’t have much words to Thank you for the Great job you’re doing for fandom. Love you guys and Love Supernatural Forever!
This was an amazing summary! I really wish Jensen and Jared would come to the UK cons. But Misha goes annually so that’s good enough for me 🙂
hahahaahhaaaa,plucking gray hair from jared’s head,jensen is hilariously awesome…..,these two guys always made it so easy and entertaining when they are together and they are too having fun this is the best thing which makes fans also feel the same and and comfortable:) jensen and jared have the most awesome relationship i’ve ever seen,we all agree these two are meant to be brothers,we love them and wish them a lot of happy years ahead,and sooooooooooooooooooo much success(which they already have)so i want to say THANK YOU JARED AND JENSEN,for being such amazing human beings and so humble and so funny as well.LOVE SPN LOVE JARED & JENSEN:) and also thank you fangasm for sharing those moments with the fans who can’t get there:( like me from pakistan(asia) lots of love to you too:)))))keep it up:)
Thank you so much for sharing all of this!
(Here’s hoping Sam and Dean aren’t too emotionally stunted for a quick “Love you bro” at the end of season 10 lol)
Why did you change from being so definite about the ILY to being suddenly unsure? I was at the M&G too, he was *definite* about it. The line was in the script. Did you get leaned on by Wincest fans? Because other people can corroborate what you said initially.
Several people questioned it, and we honestly weren’t sure without notes. Thanks for corroborating – another report did as well, so we’ve ETA’d once again. Doing a report without notes is way too stressful!
1st – I bought my copy of Fangasm last night can’t wait to get it! 2nd – I am a huge fan of SPN and have been from the start. I agree that some seasons have really bright moments and dark ones. I’ve love some seasons that other fans haven’t. That all being said I’ve always thought the writers have been very fair to the both lead characters. After reading everything here it really does saddens me, that people don’t think Dean has a storyline. However it is interesting that Dean was in “purgatory” as if to say the character is in limbo? I really don’t think so though. I just always want harmony between characters, fans and writers. *Sigh* I know that’s a lot to ask for. I am looking forward to my 1st Con and probably only Gold experiences I will have. Thank you for sharing all ur wisdom w/ us even if u r on lock down, jeeze. Please keep on, keepin on – COMWS – Long Live SPN 🙂
Thanks for the write-up. However, something strange:
Earlier when I read this article, it said: “In the scene with Cas beating Dean up, there was consideration of Dean saying ‘I love you,’ but it didn’t seem like something Dean would actually come out and say, so he said ‘We’re family’ (This explains how certain priceless S8 gag reel scenes happened…)”
But now I find this instead:
“Jensen said something about the scene with Cas beating Dean up, there was consideration of Dean saying something like ‘I love you,’ or something about love [do not recall exactly, sorry!], but it didn’t seem like something Dean would actually come out and say, so it was changed to ‘We’re family’ (My interpretation is that in both cases, he was talking about familial love, hence the change to ‘we’re family’. I also thought that might explain how certain priceless S8 gag reel scenes happened…)”
“Something like?” “Something about love”? “Do not recall exactly”? But do recall all that was said about scenes with Sam? Generally my memory tends to fade as more time goes by; not become clearer as happened here, and especially about one character as compared to the other! This is quite amusing really. 😀
I wonder whether my comment will be posted! 😉
I wonder if my reply to you will appear? Because I left a question here about this myself a while ago, and it hasn’t appeared. Like you I’m side-eyeing the laser-intense memory when it comes to recalling the Wincest fanservice when set alongside the sudden attack of forgetfulness about statements that emphasize the Dean-Cas bond.
Appear it has, but I don’t see your other question. I remembered the answer to my specific question about the line between Sam and Dean because it was my question, but several people questioned the rest and I honestly wasn’t sure without notes and would hate to misquote anyone. Another report recalls it the same, tho, so I’ve ETA’d once again. Alas, laser intense memory is not one of my strengths in the midst of a hectic con weekend.
Posted it is! A few people questioned my recollection of that specific bit, so I thought I might be wrong, and would never want to misquote someone – hence the reminder that it’s possible I got it not exact. The first part of what he said I was sure I heard right, because that was my actual question. At least one other person who was there has now posted that the original version was correct, however, so I can ETA again to take out the caveat. Posting without notes is too damn nervewracking. Glad it amused you though – and thanks for the original language reminder.
Sorry shipper fans are being difficult lol. The majority of us appreciate you heartily! <3
Louisa, why do you assume that “shipper fans” are being difficult? Also, which shipper fans are those? The Wincest shippers, the J2 tinhatters, or the Destiel shippers? Who are the majority?
Let’s see if my reply is posted, given that Louisa’s comment was!
The Destiel shippers of course. Why would those others have any problem with this?
Reblogged this on Dear Supernatural….
Thanks for the write up! I always enjoy reading your take on the conventions.
I gotta be honest, though- I was kind of bothered by this:
“Lynn: In the scene where Dean is trying to convince Sam not to go with Death, and says that memorable line, “There ain’t no me if there ain’t no you,” alot of us weren’t sure if that was actually Dean — if Ezekiel sent Dean in to convince Sam and then switched places with him to possess Sam — or if that was Ezekiel looking like Dean. When you were doing that scene, how were you playing it?
Jensen: I was playing it as Ezekiel.
Lynn: (gasping rather dramatically) Noooooo, that’s not the answer I want!
Jensen: (probably rolling his eyes a little at Lynn. Which is totally understandable) Sorry!”
As much as I love the brotherly moments, I think that we’ve seen over the years how Dean’s extreme, unresolved codependence has taken a huge toll on his self worth. We know he doesn’t value himself or his own life, that he thinks he’s crap and that Sam is the only brother who deserves to be happy. So, even if he believes it in his heart, I was actually glad that the real Dean didn’t say that line. I actually would find it heartbreaking to hear Dean admit aloud that not only does he feel he can’t exist without Sam but that he also has no identity as an individual. So, given those negative psychological implications, I was surprised that you were disappointed in Jensen’s answer. Or did you understand it in another context?
Of course in real life you’re totally right, and if Dean were real I would definitely hope the same! I can allow my fictional characters to be alot more messed up and find that to make for compelling drama, though. That said, I do think Dean has (and deserves) an identity, and we can certainly see all his strengths clearly — I just think in that moment of panic, all he would have been thinking about is how much he doesn’t want to be without his brother. The line made sense to me in that context, in a moment of desperation. Good thing I’m not a writer for the show probably 🙂 lol
I agree with you completely! Dean is a fictional character. Supernatural just wouldn’t be as interesting if he were completely without hangups, and I love the brothers and their relationship as well. If my only family left was dying, I’d say the same!
We know Dean can exist without Sam. He has in the past – while he was with Lisa, in Purgatory. I think it more comes down to whether or not Dean wants too. Which he would prefer not too. He is happier when he is around Sam & Sam is alive.
We all have those people in our lives. Dean just happens to have the means to keep Sam around & alive – via demon deal or angel possession or whatever supernatural means. I can’t say for certain that if I (god forbid) lost my daughter & I had the option to make a demon deal to bring her back, that I wouldn’t. I’m in no way codependent with my daughter, I just love her THAT much & am willing to do anything to keep her safe & happy. I think it is very much the same for Dean with Sam.
Sam & Dean are their own individual people. I don’t get this complaint that Dean’s identity is wrapped up solely in Sam. I just don’t see it. Sam & Dean are the rock/center of each others lives – with the life they lead (and have lived) it only makes sense. Yeah, their little family is growing, but it still very much the two of them in the world.
I agree with spnfans & think the “there ain’t no me, if there ain’t no you” line was said in desperation. Dean/Zeke needed to get through to Sam how much Sam means to Dean. And that is what came out.
Dean would exist without Sam, but it would just be a fairly miserable existence.
With EVERYTHING Dean has been through, there is no way he would be a well-adjusted, psychologically sound dude with healthy relationships anyways. It is just not realistic.
Thank you for the comments. You know, if the M&G weren’t sold out then I could understand the policy. But you can’t get into those things unless you preplan well in advance (or go to one con and get it right then for the next year). So… thanks for sharing your questions as frankly the answer regarding Dean vs Ezekiel in that scene was the thing I wanted to know most.
Thanks for all you do.
Any Look at these guys is like opening a present, and they have such great personalities,They just make you smile and have sweet dreams. Very, Very Talented also !! :} Thank You!
I’m a new fan and enjoy3d watching clips of conventions on youtube. This is my first time reading a summary and I totally enjoyed it. Thanks